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Post by sharon on Aug 4, 2012 18:12:13 GMT -6
Wow.
Wow.
Well, I guess you aren't willing to read the information I shared. Or else you consider forfeiting food and housing "minimal effort."
Not sure what else I can do, except hope that most voters will actually learn more about the issue.
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Post by sharon on Aug 4, 2012 18:24:59 GMT -6
Here are a few more examples my wife found of eligible voters who would be denied their right to vote based on this amendment:
**You move to MN in late October, more than 20 days before election day. You are eligible to vote, but your MN ID has not arrived in the mail, even though you applied for it the day you moved.
**You work 2,3, or even 4 part-time jobs to feed your kids, pay the rent (in a building that should be condemned and is in an unsafe neighborhood), and keep your kids in a crappy day care while you work all those jobs. You will be fired if you take any time off (because your employers all say since you are only working for me part time, you have lots of time to take care of things like this). You don't have a car because you can't afford it, so you ride the bus and the nearest place to get an ID is a 45 minute bus ride. You get off work at 5:30 and have to get your kids by 6:00 or you pay $5 a minute late fee. Because you are working so many part time jobs, you are working on getting your kids to/from day care, 7 days a week, during all of the hours that the office to get your ID is open.
**You are a college student in MN, but your ID has your home (permanent) address. You are eligible to vote at your college address and want to do so, but your ID doesn't have the correct address.
**You need access to your birth certificate to get an ID, but you have to pay to get that. If you get make it to the office during office hours (see above), you can request one by mail, but you have to have the application signed by a notary. You now have to pay the notary, too. You also have to have time to be able to get the application.
***College students sometimes change addresses very frequently, as do people with lower socio-economic status.
**You are a victim of domestic violence participating in an address confidentiality program for your own safety. Your ID does not list your actual address.
These are just a few examples and of course is not an exhaustive list.
I hear that for YOU it has always been easy to have a photo ID and that is great. But for those who can't get one, it being easy for you, really does nothing to help them.
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Post by danikasmom on Aug 4, 2012 19:44:44 GMT -6
If you applied for an ID you would be eligible to vote with the paper copy along with your former ID.
The whole 4 jobs argument is such balderdash that I won't even discuss it. That person is unlikely to vote anyways, saying that this is the one thing that prevents him or her from voting is specious reasoning at best.
Most banks have a notary on site, and many will waive the minimal fee they charge (my husband did this many times at the bank he worked at).
If you are moving all the time you should be updating your ID every time, if you do that it will still be valid, if you fail to do that you are currently breaking MN law and I don't see why you should be able to pick and choose which laws you follow.
Domestic Violence issue? You will likely be voting absentee anyways, which is still easy to do.
Honestly the birth certificate issue you raised is the only one that has any real validity, and even that is pretty sketchy since it is still fairly easy to do.
And again, how many people who voted in the last election were unable to provide an ID? You need an ID to function in the world as it is today, the people who don't have one probably don't care that much anyways. This issue strikes me as much more a "White Guilt" talking point than something that will have any actual effect on elections.
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Post by sharon on Aug 4, 2012 19:54:20 GMT -6
Wow, so now the people who won't be allowed to vote don't matter because in your opinion they won't care? I wouldn't make that decision for someone else. But I will be voting No.
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Post by danikasmom on Aug 4, 2012 20:23:57 GMT -6
Wow, so now the people who won't be allowed to vote don't matter because in your opinion they won't care? I wouldn't make that decision for someone else. But I will be voting No. Yes clearly that is what I said. Your reading comprehension is amazing. Voting is a right you have to exercise. Sometimes exercising rights takes some modicum of effort. If you are unwilling to expend the effort required (and I will grant you that it is easier for some than others) then I don't see why we should even possibly risk a fraudulent election result because you are too lazy to put forth the minimal effort involved. If you want to vote you will take the required steps. If you don't want to take those steps than you clearly don't care about voting that much, and I don't care if the ignorant masses can't show up to vote for Obama or Romney.
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Post by sharon on Aug 4, 2012 20:32:31 GMT -6
When you have to forfeit your housing and/or food for your family if you want to vote, or face some of the other barriers to voting you are in favor of for others, I will feel more confident that you know the "modicum of effort" you so non-chalantly expect of others. Thanks for complimenting my reading comprehension
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Post by sarahisis on Aug 4, 2012 21:56:15 GMT -6
Uffda........Is political season over yet?
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Post by sharon on Aug 5, 2012 6:25:00 GMT -6
Tell me about it. Imagine how you would feel if it was you one of these amendments was directly about.
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Post by dara1012 on Aug 5, 2012 9:02:24 GMT -6
I will be voting "no". After years of work in social services and volunteering in the community with underprivileged populations I have seen the people who this would directly effect and learned about their lives. It is not as simple as going to get an ID and for those people who think it is I encourage you to spend time getting to know people who are home-bound, people who are elderly and don't have a birth certificate (b/c the state didn't issue them automatically when they were born), people with disabilities, people who live in homeless shelters. I have found in working with these population (either in my employment or through volunteering) that they live their life in such chaos of the unknown that those of us with stability would never understand and what might be a simple task to go to the DMV for me, is not so simple for them. My socioeconomic, cultural and educational privilege should not make my vote better than any other person's vote.
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Post by irish on Aug 5, 2012 10:32:31 GMT -6
Beautifully said, Dara.
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Post by irish on Aug 5, 2012 11:29:43 GMT -6
Here's a hint it's not the black guy.
Just a little offensive, fyi..
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Post by sharon on Aug 5, 2012 13:21:49 GMT -6
I just finished the book I was reading (Alligator Bayou by Donna Jo Napoli) and this note in the afterward made me think of this and other recent discussions on here:
"This is a story that hurts. But pain isn't always bad. Pain can help us gain the empathy that compels us to act decently. We can't afford to be ignorant about bigotry. Not in our history. Not in our present day."
To that I say, Amen.
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Post by dara1012 on Aug 5, 2012 16:18:34 GMT -6
Very true sentiment....is the book as well written as the afterward?
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Post by sharon on Aug 5, 2012 16:43:27 GMT -6
Yes! I love historical fiction and she writes it so well! She finds some snippets of facts about a person or people or incident that is not well known and then imagines what the rest of the story might have been. It's just my kind of thing! This one is in Louisiana in the 1800's and centers around a family of Italian immigrants and their struggles to understand the Jim Crow laws and try to find their way in a town that is steeped in violent racism. There are sad parts, but also a lot of love and sweetness. I definitely recommend it.
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Post by dara1012 on Aug 5, 2012 17:24:26 GMT -6
I will have to look for it. I love historical fiction to and this sounds really interesting.
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